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Gina Birch of The Raincoats & Sharon Van Etten | Conversations With Friends
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Feb 9, 2025
As she releases her debut solo album 'I Play My Bass Loud', Gina Birch has a chat with friend and collaborator Sharon Van Etten about family, her time in The Raincoats, the difference between being political and countercultural and her many artistic pursuits. Read more music interviews at www.thefortyfive.com. Follow The Forty-Five on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/the_forty_five/
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0:00
you can always say no comment Gina
0:07
say um make the answer slightly shorter because we're gonna run out of time
0:13
[Music] I'm 103 years old and
0:21
um and um I'm Gina Birch and I have just got a
0:29
new record out I was in a band called the raincoats and uh now I've made my
0:35
first solo album as Gina Birch and I'm really happy to be here
0:41
and I'm also a painter and I Sharon and I have had a bit of a collab
0:47
front um anyway I'll shut up
0:53
um my name is Sharon Van Etten and I I
0:58
write songs and have a band but I am a fan of Gina and I feel lucky enough to
1:07
call her a friend and and we have just collaborated on a book together that I
1:12
am so excited about and I am excited for your new record Gina it is so good
1:20
amazing it's a very lovely thing to hear you say Sharon because you're amazing
1:30
I knew your before I ever met you and but I believe the first time we met was when I came
1:39
through on a press tour in about 2011. and and uh your partner Mike Holdsworth
1:48
um is my my project manager at secretly Canadian and he would always host me
1:54
whenever I came over and you both would host an amazing meal and amazing
2:02
conversation where I went home and I would research half the things you talked about because it was so compelling
2:08
and I was just very moved by how open you were as an artist and as a parent
2:16
and um just how you both connect with each other and still have so much passion in
2:23
the music industry you know for living in a city that could you know you could easily be jaded but there was always so
2:30
much passion and joy that you have in in your
2:36
lives that was very inspiring to me as a Young musician
2:41
oh that's lovely to hear I mean Mike is amazing in in as as a cook a chef and
2:48
he's very interested in food and wine and Cooks all sorts of interesting things I'm much more I'm I I I'm like a
2:56
speed cook so you know you don't really want to come for dinner when I'm cooking but it's lovely when Mike's cooking
3:03
um yes it was amazing uh you know when when you came round and you were just so
3:09
beautiful and funny and lovely and warm and you know it's just great to meet you
3:16
and then hearing your music and so it's lovely and and then you know
3:22
when when I found out you were pregnant I mean that was just like well hey you
3:27
know I it's it was uh that was a very special we were in we were in New York when we we were in New York when that
3:34
happened and we did a photo and stuff yeah you know Sharon my daughter's honey and Layla I'm sure we will talk about uh
3:41
things to do with those uh lovely offsprings that we have
3:46
uh yeah honey is my older daughter and Lele the younger I have so many
3:51
questions and I'm trying to figure out how to tie it in but since we're talking about families I have been curious since
4:00
you know raising two daughters um how has that changed if at all your
4:06
creative process and has it changed what you want to write about or the the
4:12
subject matter that you either want to create in in your in your painting world
4:18
and also has it inspired you more in your songwriting um as you've evolved
4:26
it's funny really because um when the kids were small I I wasn't really thinking about I mean I've never
4:34
really thought about a career I I started in the 70s and in the 70s you
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know career and money was kind of a bit of a dirty word we thought we thought oh that's you know it's like oh you know
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but I'm for you know fortunately we could all live for free you know living in squats we we uh food was very cheap
4:54
we we didn't really have have big bills to pay so we just we could be creative
5:00
without worrying about where the where the money was coming from so yeah I I I
5:07
when when I had um children I didn't really kind of
5:13
continue as a musician as such what I did was I kind of integrated you know I
5:21
became like um a nursery school teacher Aurora I just had lots of fun with with
5:27
them when they were small and and that's what I did it was like full time I was like a full-time Entertainer but you
5:35
know in in in you know I have to say that they were so entertaining back that it was a really
5:42
kind of mutual fun thing we did lots of Storytelling and painting and singing
5:48
and you know you know to to till till um I think it was when when maybe honey was
5:55
about nine or ten and I went and played my first show somebody asked me to go and do a solo
6:02
show and I was suddenly like went back out into the world and I was like you know suddenly somebody somebody at
6:08
the show said I'd come down from Manchester Manchester to see you and I was like you're kidding me because I
6:14
forgot that I'd you know being in some cult band or something you know I I just
6:20
thought I I was just a mum by then you know and I I I really love being a mum I
6:26
was because I was quite old by the time I did finally become a mum it was like
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it was like what I'd really wanted to do yeah so so yeah being a mom
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um didn't really impinge on my uh creative process uh and and and oh
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actually that's a lie I made lots and lots of videos and films with them and
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got them doing all sorts of crazy stuff and in fact yes they've been in all
6:57
sorts of bits of my work yeah okay I admit and I I forgot what about you tell me
7:07
how has it changed your your writing well I mean before I
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I was ever a mom I wrote mostly about heartbreak and the unhealthy relationships I was in so
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um I think as I found you know stability in my life you know the things that were
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important to me um changed and the messages that I wanted
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to leave out in the world felt a little different and the things that were on my
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mind as you see you know you know when you when you when you're
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bringing it like when you're raising a child in the world and you're like okay this there's something deeper about the
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idea of mortality in the end of the world and climate change like all the things that when I was younger were more
8:01
of a periphery um than a reality and
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um you know I just feel like the years that my son was born it was like I was pregnant when Trump
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was voted into office I moved to California and then coveted hit and like
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had experienced fires and earthquakes in a way that I never had and so a lot of
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what I've been writing the last few years has been a little darker and
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um you know the the the fear of death and what you leave behind being more of a thing for me
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um but I'm hoping that changes oh I don't know um but maybe it just evolves as well I
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feel very frivolous now you know I mean my main concern was I could never do a
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handstand so I really really to be able to do a handstand and of course
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fear of fear of the world ending but you know I I haven't
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um I haven't really integrated that in into into my work very much and I think that
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honey and Lele are both now because Honey's now 22. so crazy
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click on the world in such a big way themselves much you know and um I I put my faith in them I put my
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faith in the other younger generation we you know I I was involved in fighting
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lots of battles as I as I was growing up you know to do with kind of
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um also you know homophobia and and uh sexism and obviously you know Rock
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Against Racism however white male it was I remember yeah I remember the first
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meeting of rocks Against Racism and and it's like a lot of white people a lot of white men
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and then we started rock against sexism and I tried to be involved in that but the white men still were in control you
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know there you go um but but we did we did fight for a lot of stuff
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um and uh really really what was involved
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politically it's it's it's it's it's so weird now because I do feel a bit impotent in terms of um um
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political activity you know I I signed bloody petitions all the time
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occasionally go on marches but uh it's not you know I used to be on marches all
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the time but I'm not anymore I don't know what's going on but you have songs on your new record that go there I mean
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you have a [ __ ] Riot song on on your record and you also have a song about feminism
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um and you know just about like I feel like you're still very actively thinking
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and sharing your ideas and frustrations and your rage about what's happening in the world
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no I'm I'm definitely thinking and and uh yeah
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gosh you know I I'm I paint about this stuff I I I write
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about this stuff and uh I think um maybe my head's not doing a very good
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my head's not in a very feisty place I've been rehearsing for eight hours today and I'm like
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have a nice chat absolute in um yeah I mean I you know I think when
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the raincoats first started we were um we were an unusual uh tribe basically
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I'd seen the slits they were the first autonomous all-female band that I that
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I'd heard about or ever seen and they weren't they had no man pulling the
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strings they put themselves together they were feisty they were funny they
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were crazy they were they were cross you know they were they were they were beautiful and the the songs just
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completely spoke to me and and and I knew it was kind of part of a bit
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of a revolution you know it felt like things were changing things were shifting and punk felt like that in
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general but when I saw this like all female band I knew that it had gone like
12:29
further and I I really wanted to be part of it so when we when we became an
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all-female band in the raincoats it was it was really really exciting and really thrilling and we knew that we were doing
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something you know interesting and good but we were also quite heavily criticized because we didn't
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we didn't look like they wanted girls to look we didn't sound like they wanted
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girls to sound so we kind of wound a lot of people up but you know in in in in
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retrospect you know that stuff was actually served as well because the world's caught up with this but what
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what happened really I suppose is like you know I'm getting around to [ __ ] Riot but what happened was we we kind of
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stopped and then when Riot girl started in Olympia Washington they kind of said
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to us you know you were you and the slits and were a big influence on on on
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us and and uh and that was really extraordinary for us we were like oh my God you know those P
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it didn't all just die a death it actually is it actually has been kind of
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growing and growing in a that what's that saying you know they they tried to
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cover they tried to bury me but they didn't know I was a seed you know
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France really isn't it because you know uh things things do get buried but but uh
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somewhere along the line these things are growing and and and
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um that you know that I don't know then they're growing and
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they're nurturing and fertile or I can't think of any words but you know and
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um so after that you know when when I saw [ __ ] Riot you know what what what what
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the raincoats did was we made little little steps you know
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I remember at one gig in Birmingham I think everyone in the audience emptied the part their pockets of Lighters and
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coins and gardeners were and they all chucked things at us we were like bombarded because they hated us so much
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but you know the risks we took were pretty minor and then with the the riot
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girl girls they were they were much much more outspoken about feminism and they took a lot more risks than we did and
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then the next level is the [ __ ] Riot women who really
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um you know when when you're fighting against uh the church and Putin you know
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you really um setting yourself up for um some big backlash you know and uh so you
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know I I think their bravery was astonishing and and learned lots and lots of Brave women around the world
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doing all sorts of incredible things that far braver than anything
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I've ever been involved with and and I I I I do try to make work about some of
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those women because I think that's incredibly powerful basically Anna and I were much more counter-cultural and
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probably Palmolive but then Vicky joined the band and she had been in a much more
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political uh environment and in political bands so when she joined the
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band you know she just she was like look you may not think what you're doing is a
16:00
a a feminist act she said but you know you're you're writing your own songs you've done you you're making your own
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artwork you're very you're autonomous you're doing all this stuff and what
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you're doing is a feminist act and we were like really okay you know it's kind of like we were yeah we we were
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counter-cultural and Vicky came in and brought some politics and and we were kind of
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we kind of embraced it but we you know we we weren't uh we weren't a political
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ban no but but we were but Vicky was a political person and so
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you know when there's one one in four of you has that has that notion and they're
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also writing songs I mean she wrote off duty trip was which was about a a a soldier
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um on leave raping a woman and getting off free for her for for committing the
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rape as awful lot of men do but you know this was a soldier so blah blah blah
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um yeah so so um that was kind of a political statement
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um I would say yeah more counter-cultural than political you know as I've got older
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I've got kind of more political in one way and less political in another you know
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it's it's I do feel you know every generation and you will find this Sharon
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but you know honey and Lele uh that there's a kind of young people and you
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know there's two Michelle only too well they're they have embraced
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something to kind of attack that the older generation to do with
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language and gender and so on and um you know that the way the def the
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definitions that you know we always saw a blurring of blurring of gender and the
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blurring of sexuality and you know oh yes we're all gender fluid and you know
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if you talk like that to honey and Lele you know you get boom [Laughter]
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yeah it's I I appreciate their their passion and their need to redefine
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redefine language and redefine relationships and everything
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I mean you know my parents drove me crazy because you know my dad you know
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the patriarchy was for in full swing in my in my home in my house you know um my
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dad was in charge and my mum never wanted to cause any trouble and
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you know it was quite depressed and unfulfilled you know and that actually
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was almost like a catapult you know I like I was pulling around either boing you know
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just I'm just gonna break out of this thing because I'm not gonna be like that what
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was your what what was you the relationship of your parents like Sharon
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um you know my parents they're they're you know they're wonderful people and um you know I grew up
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thinking that my dad um was more liberal than my mother because my mom and I fought all the time
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um but as I got older and I reflected and I'm getting to know them now as an adult
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um you know my dad's much more conservative but he was more of a rocker guy Stoner guy when he was growing up so
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I saw that as liberal but my mom was you know she's a feminist
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and you know she's a spiritual person that she went from being religious to more spiritual and studying you know
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studied Buddhism and she was also a history teacher she wasn't you know a
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painter and she went from art to art history to history as she had children and went to night school as I was a kid
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and by the time I was in you know in sixth grade she had gotten her Masters and became a teacher after staying home
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for 15 years raising five children and so those things that I could not
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appreciate um at the time and only saw you know my
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my dad going to work and my mom being stressed out all the time just changed for me seeing what their Dynamic is like
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and they both worked very hard in different ways and I and I understand you know a lot more as an adult word
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they come from and their Roots my dad's Irish Catholic my mom was in a military family
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and you know there's just so many layers of like what you know they came from and
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how it affects them now but you know we're much closer than ever um they didn't really understand my my
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drive to do music they knew I was passionate about it but they always wanted me to have a backup plan
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um nice job as a bank teller or whatever
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but you know I understand that now too because in a way I I don't even know if
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I would be on the path that I've been on if I hadn't um you know had jobs along the way and
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still figured out how to get you know jobs within the music world to
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understand better how the music world worked and that's you know what brought ended up bringing me to bada bing
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records and getting an internship and learning as an intern and then going
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that way but you know because they were like you should if you're going to school for music why don't you go for
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like business and I was like oh I don't like this at all and then I thought maybe I'll do
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production and then I was like you know what I think I'm better I'm not good in the
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classroom I'm good with my hands and I need to I need to learn by doing not by studying a book and hearing lectures on
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on formulas that I don't necessarily um subscribe to
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um so meeting Ben Goldberg at bottoming records was pretty life-changing for me
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and it's because of him that I got turned on to this era of music because I
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you know I I was still learning a lot about you know Indie music you know growing up with my my family was lots of
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records and bigger shows I moved away from home and I worked at like a DIY venue and then I learned what touring
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bands were like but then getting a job at a label with someone as specific as
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Ben Goldberg who's a he you know he turned me on to this Post Punk era of music that just
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just changed my direction and changed like how I thought of songwriting and
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instrumentation and just you know the like the the rawness of a lot of the
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music I was hearing and reading about um and I read this one particular book rip it up and it was around the time
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where I would I discovered like I just had just like heard young marble Giants for the first time and that's when I
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heard you for the first time and I was just I was I was yeah it was you know
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it's like when you know one door closes another door opens and you know I felt like every time I learned something
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another you know another thing was happening and uh that's not something you can really go to school for and I
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felt like Ben would show me things as he saw that I was interested in it and just
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you know keep giving me records and recommending me books and in a way that I don't think I could have done at
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school yeah well I you know I I think all these uh
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commercial music courses of which I have actually taught a little bit on
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you know I I know times are different now and uh people all seem to need to
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have a degree or something but going to University to study
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that and reading you know reading these books on philosophy or psychology or
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whatever they do and that these kids
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it confuses me I it's a whole other way of learning and being and I I think
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doing you've got to do it you gotta do it um I don't know anyway
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are you into so you went to Art School pretty early on right I went to art
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school after school yes and uh it was it really did open my eyes because I I am I
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was quite a kind of mischievous teenager I got I was I was very bored I was very bored and I kind of hung out with all
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the the baddies in the town because they assume most fun and interesting so I I
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got up to a lot of crazy got into a lot of crazy scrapes um but it was only when I went to art
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school that I discovered my people you know suddenly I was in Trent poly and
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Nottingham doing um foundation and all the different art departments were there in the canteen and stuff and I was like
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whoa this is amazing and I discovered all sorts of things about art and all
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the different types of finer in Orlando conceptual hard time
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you know all these different performance are all these different things that just kind of
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excited me so much and and then I had all these new friends who were all kind
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of slightly offbeat in a in a brilliant way you know they weren't uh that they
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they weren't like the people I knew before they weren't like the the local crimps from Nottingham or father or all
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the girls from Nottingham High School all of whom were lovely people you know but it was only when I went to art
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school that I really you know that thing kind of went whoa and I was so excited
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by life um I think you know up till that I think I remember saying to my mum this is the
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best year of my life so far I I loved the foundation yes so much
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because you learned so much it opens your eyes to so many things as well
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certainly a a a woman a a girl of my age in that time you know many years ago it
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was uh it was it was the place to have your uh have your eyes opened as a kind
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of slightly uh Wayward young person you could feed all that energy into
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something exciting and creative and uh that was great and then and then you do
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one year there and then then I came to London and I kind of fell into punk I fell into you know the squatting scene
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uh and and all I was in Alexandra Palace there was a boy on my course who knew I
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was I was looking somewhere to live and I moved into this squat in the middle of
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kind of All Things Groovy
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I think a lot of people today would find it really hideous because there was plaster was all falling off the wall we
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only had cold water I had two gas rings on the floor and they were kind of slightly leaking and uh um you know
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there was nothing there was nothing glamorous about it per se but it was glamorous to me because it was so
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different than exciting and it was also yours right and it was your first place and you had just left home and so that
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that part is pretty liberating right I mean I like ours because it was like all the rich people had evacuated from like
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base water and Notting Hill so it was full of squats and and the streets there
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were squat cafes and loads and loads of second-hand shops and I suppose it was like you know Manhattan in the 70s you
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know it was It was kind of people talk about it being in a terrible State and it was in a terrible state but
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spiritually for us young people it was Bloody marvelous you know it was
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yeah the community and the feeling on the streets as you as you walk down the street you felt like you owned the
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streets do you know what I mean it was like this is this is my manner this is my place and uh
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yeah till a few Ted's arrived in me like stop it
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or did because you like artist creatives that it was it
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wasn't that wasn't a thing I have this method if I ever feel like I'm being chased or something I I start
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kind of loping and kind of trying to look a bit Looney
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[Laughter]
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yeah I that was always my method I never I never knew whether it worked or not
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but so far I'm gonna use that
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so my I grew up in New Jersey um and my teenage years were in the
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suburbs and you know cul-de-sac Community kind of thing
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um you know I had I was lucky enough to be able to do musical theater and
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um and I I got acoustic guitar lessons and when I was a teenager but and I did
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choir but you know I wouldn't I wouldn't say I had found myself by any means
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um but it was my my music teacher that told me about the School in Tennessee
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that had a recording program and um that was the the one thing my my
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parents approved of was me going to the school because it had the backup plan
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and so I went there um in Murfreesboro Tennessee to Middle
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Tennessee State and um you know I I I I wasn't really enjoying
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school and I I think I was just too distracted by the freedom of you know
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being away from my family and just falling into going to shows and falling
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in love and like doing all the things Without Really caring about school
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um and you know I'll shorten that story by just saying when I when I realized
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that I that wasn't the place I needed to be I moved back home with my parents and
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then decided to move to New York um within a year of living with them because I realized if I'm Really Gonna
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pursue music I have to be in the thick of it I can't be on the outskirts of it because I am
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the kind of person that I need to be surrounded by other people that are busy that are doing [ __ ] you know because if
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I I'm you know what I'm I'm easily influenced by others so if I see other
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people doing things or I'm inspired by what they're doing and they bring me into the things that they're making and
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the things that they're thinking then it helps me get excited but I I wouldn't be
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excited in my parents house that we couldn't get excited like you know commuting to New York like every couple
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days is quite you know an adventure in itself but I think being surrounded in
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it was really inspiring to just see like everybody had more than one thing going on at the same time and you know New
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York is definitely the place that I'm I'm glad that I went and I lived for like almost 15 years what year did you
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arrive in New York um it was around 2005 or six
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well I wish I could teleport over there and see your show tomorrow and um I know
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that it'll be so incredible um and I'm just so I'm so happy for you
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and I you know I I can't wait to play Denver your record because I was you
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know listening to it taking notes and just you know just thinking about
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you know how um I don't know I'm just so proud of you I'm I know it's big to to try new things
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and you know when you finally when you have developed a note you're this thing and then you're moving on to another
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thing and I'm not being very articulate right now but um it's a big it's a big it's a big
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thing making a record and trying something new and um I'm I'm so happy that's coming from a
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person who's done all sorts of exciting and wonderful things and all your acting and you know that's been quite
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extraordinary you know being in that uh
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challenging yourself right I mean otherwise you just keep doing the same thing over and over again
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when you were filming that did it feel like as weird as it looks when you're when we're watching it
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I mean you know I'm like in my underwear in like a cage you know being scared of
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a scientist who's um doing a experiments on us because of our near-death
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experiences I mean trying to conjure those emotions was definitely um awkward
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um yeah but yeah I don't know I learned that I'm not like I'm not you know I'm glad I was I'm glad I challenged
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myself to do stuff like that but I you know I don't think I thrive in an acting environment but I think for
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um you know writing process and improvisation and um working with other people and having
34:24
more of an appreciation for that field you know I'm glad I tried it but I think
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yeah as that is not where I will pursue my Endeavors well it was a particularly probably
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difficult possibly grueling experience
34:45
yeah so I had just taken a break from the band to go back to school and I had
34:50
applied to Brooklyn College and had gotten in and um just as I had gotten like the
34:57
acceptance letter I got asked to audition for this show and um you know Zeke had convinced me to
35:05
take a chance you know he's like if the school will let you
35:11
um defer your enrollment to the next semester you should take this opportunity and audition and if you get
35:17
the audition you should just take it because you know he's like it's an adventure [Laughter]
35:24
and I remember thinking like you know it was a big deal to tell my band that I was taking a break
35:29
um to focus on school because you know I'm still pursuing a psychology degree but with all the other things it's just
35:36
chipping away you know it's like a class or two every every other year basically
35:43
um but um but you know I felt like I was kind of a phony if I was taking a break from tour
35:50
to you know go to school and then I get sidetracked by acting it just it seemed
35:56
like um a silly thing to do but Zeke you know the constant Adventurer and encourager
36:05
he was like you can do both and we can figure this all out and and so I I did
36:10
the thing and it was fun and challenging but also like you know I went straight
36:16
from that and and you know deferred my Roman and went to school and I really loved it and then I went to go to a
36:23
second semester but that's when I found out I was pregnant and so I was you know the second semester of school
36:30
um like you know seven months pregnant or something and uh so I got to do one
36:36
one semester before I had my child
36:41
um and so it's just lots of you know lots of Life getting in the way but it
36:46
was you know Adventure after Adventure challenge after Challenge and you know
36:52
took classes during you know during covet as well um which
36:58
you know was really inspiring as well I took a Sociology class and
37:03
um I I found out about this organization out here called a new way of life which
37:09
helps formerly incarcerated women reconnect you know have a place to live and go to therapy reconnect with their
37:16
families clear their records and get jobs and reassimilate to society and
37:21
have like a support group within the houses they're living in I started by this woman Susan Burton who
37:28
has now opened 12 houses out here and um and she is teaching other women in other
37:36
countries well in other states and other countries and and how to start these houses for women that are coming out of
37:42
prison and having a safe place for them to live and it was pretty inspiring and that this an organization that I'm I'm
37:49
trying to partner with and raise money raise awareness for as well as help them
37:54
raise some funds along the way um but still don't have my degree but
37:59
I'm learning a lot in different ways I wondered if it was an important thing
38:07
for you both to do at this point in your career so do some to do things other than music
38:14
Gina if you want to go oh yeah well I mean I have I've been doing things other than music all along
38:20
really and but but about eight nine years ago I don't know you might probably know better me Michelle and I
38:26
suddenly became obsessed with painting and I just painted painted and uh so
38:33
that that was really thrilling and um and then you know I'd have the odd uh
38:39
raincoats um show we'd be invited here or there and we played at the pompidou center we
38:46
played in all different places in fact we played with Angel and and in in
38:52
Islington Angel Islington that
38:57
um uh and that that yeah we did the collaboration with Angel for for uh I
39:02
think it was a rough trade um anniversary um um so we had lots of different music
39:08
things but they were all kind of um raincoats related but we didn't really
39:14
record any new music so so but you know little bits and pieces of doing music
39:19
but I this is all a big surprise this is this is the inter this is the one that's
39:25
kind of interfering with my painting rather than the other way around if you know what I
39:31
mean well there's this lovely young woman called Evie tar and Evie Works Evie
39:40
works for she worked for Thames and Hudson and she um
39:46
very very interesting um charismatic young woman and she had this
39:52
idea to kind of partner uh lyric writers with visual artists and um she's a huge
40:00
Sharon fan um she it transpires she lives just down
40:05
the road here wow so funny so she approached Sharon
40:12
somewhere in America wherever you are Sharon I'm never quite sure and um and
40:18
then Sharon mentioned me and because um you'd seen some of my painting and
40:25
and I I I we talked about me doing a kind of painted version of your amazing
40:33
um you're amazing cover it's so funny when I see this record I like I feel like I
40:40
know every inch because I I've painted every little bit
40:46
of it and uh but I painted it quite kind of literally and maybe that wasn't quite what you had
40:52
in mind but um it was really enjoyable to do and um well honestly I loved that I love that
41:00
painting and the only reason it hasn't been used is we didn't end up because we were gonna do like a like a
41:07
rare like a demo version or deluxe version which didn't end up happening but hopefully it
41:14
will one day and I love that painting very much by the way well writing
41:20
present when it happens it's uh and it might be on the cover of
41:26
the book um so I I I I
41:31
interpreted or I don't know I made paintings that maybe relate to some of
41:37
Sharon's lyrics and uh so it's kind of almost like a bit of a collaboration they're like a little bit in
41:44
conversation because they're not I'm not like illustrating the lyrics I'm just kind of making a painting which perhaps
41:51
kind of slightly comment comments on the lyrics or it's but we had that conversation I remember
41:57
I like after I got off the phone it almost felt like I had a therapy session or something but you know you asked me
42:04
to you know talk about like memories and meaning but then also just like images
42:09
and colors and like you know emotions that came to mind and it was like I you
42:16
know I was like I didn't realize like you know what you would use it for and
42:22
in terms of your own inspiration but I was just like I felt like I've get I've
42:28
talked so much and I got so much out after our phone call but I was like hopefully she's not scared of me now
42:34
um but you know everything he made is so beautiful and um you know it's very it's
42:39
very emotive and um you know I know that they're not you know direct interpretations of my songs but I feel
42:46
like a lot of the feelings and um you know sentiments are there you know and
42:53
um and I yeah and I love I love all of your choices so I'm excited to see it in
43:00
real real life it's quite small isn't it I'm like
43:05
oh we wanted to be a bit anyway
43:13
well I'm sorry I didn't I I wasn't asked to prepare any questions so I I wish I
43:19
had been because I mean you know I I I am we can just we just chat and uh it's
43:25
it's it's really nice to know about you know but I I'm really intrigued how you
43:30
get on with this new process in your writing you know actually writing together with the band and it was
43:37
interesting for me yeah write it sorry I'm just going to talk about me again sorry um when I came up with the the I gave
43:45
the lyrics to Youth and then he came up with the um guitar part and then I had
43:51
to sing this in the chorus I used to wish I was you and now you wish you were
43:56
me and and so I had this I I've written on and I just off the top
44:01
of my head that day I wrote I wrote the lyrics and and then that night I went home and I thought I can't sing that
44:07
that's such a weird thing to sing in the chorus and so I then I I wrote These
44:12
verses which kind of completely undermined what was happening in the chorus
44:21
oh no not [Laughter]
44:27
just kind of coming up with things on the spot and seeing what happened and so I think it's quite an interesting idea
44:34
to go to the desert and so romantic going to the desert just having
44:40
discourse you know and I just like and after a couple years of being so apart
44:46
from everyone it was so nice like you said before to be in a room and to connect and and write in this way and to
44:54
to perform and collaborate in this way where we're talking to each other we're bouncing off ideas it's a conversation
45:01
you know it's not like you send an idea Into The Ether and you're just like I have no idea what I just did you know
45:08
it's like it just felt much more more of an extension of our relationship
45:13
to be able to do something like that but I'm still learning how to do and and as an you know as a writer but
45:21
um yeah I'm curious where it goes too stop did someone come with a little riff
45:27
or did you have some lyrics or how how did you progress them
45:32
I mean I it it you know once we got to a place it was like I would have one
45:38
person start something you know or if we were just messing around and I heard a sound I said okay that is I like what
45:45
that sound is and then we would all Focus like hone in on whatever that sound was and it all
45:50
kind of fall into that um and I would still kind of I would still kind of direct but you know I
45:57
would I would let there be a free play before I started like conducting you
46:03
know um and my lyrics I'm still working on like the lyrics aren't done um but I have phrases that I've pulled
46:11
and you know um I have to shape a little bit of like because some songs are just like jams so
46:18
I'm like okay well I can't have an album of like 10 minutes songs but like you know these ideas and
46:24
shapes and um you know like it's all there so now it's
46:29
more of just like okay now how do what do I want to say like what are the you
46:34
know I have a few I have a few songs that I know what I'm saying but then I'm like how does that affect the other songs and what do I want those to be
46:42
you record them onto digitally record them
46:47
separate track yeah so the the instruments can be
46:52
separated for sure um so I can you know we can chop them up and edit
46:57
them or have a mixer come in and send me send me different mixes I have you know roughs of them right now and I can take
47:04
my vocals out and be able to write to it if I wanted to um do you use you use a program yourself
47:14
when I'm writing at home I use Pro Tools and I and I'll send it out to other people but I'm not I don't really I
47:20
don't get lost in it because I feel like I would I would I would I would get I
47:25
would forget about the writing part and then just get obsessed with effects and so I I know it enough to like it's
47:32
basically like a four track for me and I can get my ideas in there and send it to somebody else but I can open a session
47:39
and someone else can help me with it but I don't I don't know a lot you know I try to keep it to like you know like a
47:46
big you know I have like a basic knowledge of how to listen to tracks and
47:52
record tracks but without get lost in it or you can I mean you know I've spent hours and hours and
47:58
hours in in there sometimes but I yeah I just use logic and uh yeah I know what
48:04
you mean about just can you fall into it and you're not specifically I I wasn't really kind of
48:10
writing songs so sometimes I would just have these loops and then these little phrases and then and then I'd come back
48:17
to it a while later and it'd be like I was having a conversation with my with the the story I was telling in the song
48:23
and then I'd come and I'd ask a question in a little vocal bit like a kind of Greek chorus or something
48:31
do you think you know so it's like yeah kind of conversational
48:36
interrogation and it was yeah and it's it's it's interesting working with a band
48:43
right I I've actually found it yeah quite interesting just doing it on my own at this point and uh
48:50
I I it'll be interesting to see if the two women I'm working with actually we
48:55
end up writing together or well how that works yeah oh gosh well I want to know
49:02
how like how it feels to be up there with a new band and
49:07
um you know because also also deconstructing oh my God this is a whole other conversation but
49:13
deconstructing like an album to perform live is like an art form in itself
49:19
because then you have to ask yourself like what are the most important parts for me you know I mean because you have
49:25
a lot of dub influences on this record so I'm curious like how you know like
49:31
when you when you break it down to that level is that what your show is gonna be like
49:37
um there's a little bit of that
49:42
um but I don't know I'm um but yeah that process is really interesting to me too just like what what are the what are the
49:49
bones I will I won't bore you with questions but I had them just in case I got
49:55
nervous um but it's so nice to see you both and uh thank you so much for making this
50:02
happen and I'm so excited for you Gina I love you so much
50:07
yeah I just I just that that that thing when you know of course when we met in
50:13
in New York and you were pregnant and I was like that that moment for me was just like such a
50:20
special special moment because I I you probably told loads of
50:25
people but I felt like we were like we we were really early to know that you were having a baby yeah
50:33
no it's very early you were one of the first for sure I don't even know if I
50:38
had told my parents yet um but yes uh that was very early and it
50:43
was such a special time and uh you know your your friendship means so much to me
50:50
and your art thank you uh thank you have a great rest
50:57
of the evening [Music]
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